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Modern Tart. - Portrait of a Young Man as The Artist — LiveJournal
abmann
abmann
Modern Tart.
This is a note to new readers that I have a sexfilter and I'm not afraid to use it, or evenly mistakenly post entries unlocked as I just did.

Comment to be added.
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We went to chuzhuzhe's show last night, got home at 1AM. oops. :)
I have to admit that theher show was clearly my favorite adn mostly because the two men tangoing was pretty awesome, and, yes, pretty hot. I'm secure enough in my sexuality to say that was hot, yes. Shush.

lady_fox and I got to hang out with chuzhuzhe, dragonflyknight, phoenix_snake, and returnofglitter which further illuminates both that my social life can be summarized in LJ tags and LJ is, in fact, a terribly infectious disease.

It was good stuff. I hope that TangOH! is selected for Chelonia. But it wasn't very Modern Arty. And Modern Artists can be jerks about accessibility. I know, I do it in my poetry. Fox and I were debating modern art on the way home. I think the most important part of the debate was that she hates the inaccessibiilty of it and that the inacessibility is fostered; thus, accessible art should be displayed - such as by having </a></b></a>'s piece in Chelonia. Most of my argument was that the point of modern art is to be challenging and that, from a modern atrists perspective, Mona's piece was very weak simply because it WAS exactly what it was portraying.

I do agree that there should be some explanation of context for modern art, especially temporally short visual forms. It's not enough to just put it out there. You need to offer a path to understanding. I think I can summarize our positions as such - 80/20. I prefer 80% art with 20% of the piece being "obvious" so as to allow further understanding of the remaining 80%. Fox prefers 80% accessibility with 20% hardcore modern art ideal. It's the different, I think , between flavoring a piece and keeping having the viewer/reader work for the art.

It's more complex than that; about this is all I shall write for now.
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I just realized that Yashas Attanyake works here. I lived across the hall from him Freshman year.

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Comments
justphoenix From: justphoenix Date: December 6th, 2005 03:30 pm (UTC) (Link)
Men who are secure in their masculinity are truly awesome. I've always liked boys in dresses for that reason.
abmann From: abmann Date: December 6th, 2005 03:38 pm (UTC) (Link)
Not sure I'm that secure....
Nor would I look good in a dress.
lady_fox From: lady_fox Date: December 6th, 2005 04:16 pm (UTC) (Link)
I think I'm more of a 60/40 person. 60 accessibility, 40 art. I'm fine with being taken along for the experimental ride... just give me a little map!!

That said, I know that as I study things, I understand it more, and thus need less of the accessibility. I love Phillip Glass, because I took a course, and understand what he's working at, mostly. But if I hadn't, I'd want some sort of explanation, even a written/spoken prelude saying what the idea is.

So yeah.... Maybe even 50/50....
abmann From: abmann Date: December 6th, 2005 04:35 pm (UTC) (Link)
Well, the second paragraph is most of the piont of modern art. You're supposed to work at it, understand the meaning. You study the art, the artist, the context and such to get the full meaning.

lady_fox From: lady_fox Date: December 6th, 2005 04:38 pm (UTC) (Link)
Then the whole thing is "I don't like it unless I care enough to like it."

I suppose that kind of bugs me. It's incredibly pretentious. And because of that, I can RESPECT modern art (in almost all of its forms), but not necessarily LIKE it. I don't get along well with pretentious.
rianwyn From: rianwyn Date: December 6th, 2005 04:37 pm (UTC) (Link)
I'm more in this line of thinking.
Since I have -zero- education in 'art,' all I can do is look at something and then know if I like it or not. And I can get deeper, a little... but without studying it I'm pretty much at a loss.

But a shame that I missed the Tango... I'd surely be able to have a lot to say about that. But mostly just en the dancing technique. Nothing to say, really, about the 'art' aspect of it... (except that, yes, men dancing tango is hot. Especially if it's Argentine.)
abmann From: abmann Date: December 6th, 2005 04:43 pm (UTC) (Link)
Is your enjoyment no increased when you knew waht the artist was trying to do? I think the point of much of modern art was to put the artist into the painting more rather than using it as a display or skill, talent or technique. Problematically, many put so much of themselves in their art that it because less about message or intent adn all about the artist.

It was Argentine and the show is on again tonight if you can drive really, really fast.
deep_blue_ From: deep_blue_ Date: December 6th, 2005 07:18 pm (UTC) (Link)

WTF??

You guys were here on campus? Why did my phone not ring with you calling me? :-(
I'll be going to the dance thing tonight (provided I can still walk).
abmann From: abmann Date: December 6th, 2005 07:24 pm (UTC) (Link)

Re: WTF??

Because we couldn't stay long. Sorry, I just didn't think of it.
not_a_girl From: not_a_girl Date: December 6th, 2005 09:32 pm (UTC) (Link)
I just can't like art that can't be enjoyed/appreciated when standing on its own merits with no explanation. I just don't think much of a work that can't explain itself, ie without a class of study or paragraph next to it telling you what the artist couldn't be bothered to more effectively communicate. I find a lot of contemporary art just lazy.
damn_robots From: damn_robots Date: December 6th, 2005 11:48 pm (UTC) (Link)

80/20 sounds about right

I guess its tricky cause I'm all about the school of thought where things are defined by context anyways, so no art is really standing on its own to begin with in my head. But art is certainly a subjective endeavor and not everyone thinks the way I do. I call these people that don't lame :>P. But regardless I really like modern art and art being more about ideas than being pretty and taking work to get into, but it also might be because I often have Bridget there to tell me what the context for a piece of art is, which is one of the many reasons she's awesome. One of things that I personally like about modern art is how much it being about ideas makes it a rhetorical/semiotic game, and god know I like games, rhetoric, and semiotics. Not that I don't like pretty stuff too, just I like ideas more. So in conclusion I like talking about myself and my views and brook no descent.
abmann From: abmann Date: December 7th, 2005 02:51 pm (UTC) (Link)

Re: 80/20 sounds about right

Context is important. I think it is the worthwile artist that considers everything arund them as they make something. Regardless of awareness, the world affects what we do.
abmann From: abmann Date: December 7th, 2005 02:49 pm (UTC) (Link)
A good artist can do both.
Unless it's David Sedaris. In which case, you're lucky if you get either.
not_a_girl From: not_a_girl Date: December 8th, 2005 09:44 pm (UTC) (Link)
Well, that's the thing, I really am holding up my ideal highest standard for artists. I like symbolism and deeper meaning and crap too. I like it a lot. But the best people can do art that is about an idea that has everything on the canvas (or slab, or wall, or streetcorner or whatever). This is pretty impossible sometimes though. I mean, shit, I can't pull it off.
graydancer From: graydancer Date: December 7th, 2005 04:22 am (UTC) (Link)

Free saturday?

I can't find your email, so I'm hoping to reach you here. if you (or you and your choice of partner(s)) are free on Saturday, I'm going to be putting up my suspension frame in my Studio during the day, and you're welcome to come up and visit, and we can talk of things rope, I can show you the nifty stuff from the ARS, and all sorts of fun can be had.

Or we can just drink beer and discuss the feminist theory of Robert Heinlein. But it's rare that I get a day when I can be here and working, and I thought I'd see if we could finally get together.
abmann From: abmann Date: December 7th, 2005 01:38 pm (UTC) (Link)

Re: Free saturday?

I'd love to but timing is a factor. We'll be in Beloit this Friday and Saturday afternoon for a party. If this is in the afternoon, early evening it may be doable... unless we're terribly hung over.

When were you thinking? And I'm willing to bet both my ladies would like to go. :)
graydancer From: graydancer Date: December 8th, 2005 12:26 pm (UTC) (Link)

Re: Free saturday?

Actually, just thinking of getting to know you and yours, while I'm setting up my big suspension frame in my studio. And when it's up, well, then, I would just be inclined to trade rope tricks with you.

ARS was the Austiin Ropecraft Symposium last weekend ( www.ropecraft.info ). I came home with some schwag, some new and neat tricks, etc.

And I'm going to get there around noon and be there into the early evening, so timing is perfect. Email me at graydancer at gmail dot com and I'll get you my phone #.
abmann From: abmann Date: December 7th, 2005 01:40 pm (UTC) (Link)

Re: Free saturday?

And what is ARS?
lady_fox From: lady_fox Date: December 7th, 2005 04:16 pm (UTC) (Link)

Re: Free saturday?

I'm definitely game as long as we're in town. :)
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